Video 2 For Coaches

As a coach, you know the importance of teaching your skaters good technique with proper mechanics. This video provides evidence that most coaches are confused about proper jump mechanics. Please take a look and let me know what you think of my conclusions. I honestly believe if you apply the principles in this video, your skaters will develop high-scoring, consistent jumps much more quickly. Good luck with your coaching!

86 thoughts on “Video 2 For Coaches

  1. Stephanie Radloff

    Great Job Trevor!

    One thought, can we have a judges survey? Do judges know this stuff? Would they feel insecure or threatened by the survey? Are they willing to learn? I think it would be interesting to see the judges answers to the same loop jump questions. How many judges think a loop jump rotates 1 full rotation?

    Do we know what year the loop jump was invented? Was the original design to be a real edge jump and never use the toe? I was taught to jump off the edge,but I’m sure I pushed off the toe. We TALKED as if we all jumped off the back edge, but it was like a dirty little secret to say “hey, I turn forward and push off my toe”. Know one was that brave, because you would be calling yourself a cheater. I don’t think Mr.Salchow had a toe pick. Would he be mad about advancements to figure skating blades? I think he would say “I wish I had a toe pick like that, I could have gotten more hight, maybe even done a double!”

    Thanks for your love of figure skating, Trevor

    Stephanie

    Reply
  2. Robert Mauti

    HALLELUJAH!!!!!! This is Awesome Trevor!!! Thank God for you!!! And Thank God for Fairfax and Grassroots to Champions! You and Chris Conte are AMAZING! PLEASE Keep this up!

    Much Thanks,

    Robert

    PS. Can You believe a piece of chocolate led me to this??? lol

    Reply
  3. Kay

    I feel very fortunate to have been taught these techniques by my former coach. However, I am not sure if I answered most of your Qs correctly. In fact, I doubt I did. When I answered them, I was thinking about “ideals” or technical definitions rather than what is acceptable in actual practice. The 2 have probably changed a lot over the years. Thank you for making the reality accessible to so many coaches. Your sites are fantastic. Keep putting this good stuff out there.

    Kay

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  4. Allie

    This is so interesting.

    I do have to wonder though, is that only one skater was used in you analysis. It would be helpful to have more than one skater to see more than one jump.

    Reply
  5. Kim

    This is the site to use to open your mind to new information. Thanks for the insights applied to single jumps which are rarely covered in most training. Your site is well designed, captivating, and truly motivational!

    Thanks,
    Kim

    Reply
  6. Lori

    Great idea and great site!! I think as coaches we automatically recite what the rulebooks define as a clean jump but know that the biomechanics behind the jump actually dictate something different…keep the videos and insights coming, who can we learn from if not each other?

    Reply
  7. Dawm

    Trevor, you’re awesome.
    I feel fortunate to have answered many of the questions correctly, and I truly believe this is because I’ve been a member of the PSA for 10+ years. I am not an elite level coach, but still know what I’m doing thanks to all of the coaches who share their knowledge with others.

    Reply
  8. Melissa

    Thanks Trevor for coming up with such a great resource! I think it is wonderful that someone is taking the time to do this. I forward the videos to all of my skaters so that they can take in the information as well.
    Great Job! Keep the videos coming 🙂

    Reply
  9. Sonny Finley

    Great insight Trevor.I think alot of the confusion comes from the new rules.A jump that was cheated by a quarter turn on the landing was not always given credit by the judges before.I would like to see something like this on spins.
    Sonny

    Reply
  10. Judi

    Thanks for the technical insights! I truly agree this is beneficial to visually reaffirm the biomechanics of the physical side of jumping. As a coach it especially will help my skaters psychologically by conquering the fear of the new “double” or “triple” jump. Perhaps we need to rename the jumps in degrees of actaul rotation like skiers do.

    Reply
  11. Gary

    Hi Trevor,
    I’m finding this information quite fascinating. Good for you for presenting some excellent, thought-provoking analysis. I am primarily a tennis coach and I use video analysis in my coaching. I am also assisting coaches in other sports (including figure skating) with the use of video analysis. With the easier more affordable access to video technology and software, there has been an explosion of new technical analysis and information in athletics, often exposing the dichotomy between what we think we see and what is actually happening. There is now a vast library of slow motion video analysis for tennis available on the internet. I can see that many sports (especially one’s that are based on closed-ended technical skills) are going through a similar progression, where video is helping to bring advanced technical analysis to the general population. Some coaches get it, other coaches find it a bit threatening because it tests their understanding of technique.. The adage, “video does not lie,” rings true, but you also need someone to be able to provide technical analysis of what the video shows. Just as you are finding, even when you have a video of a simple skill (i.e. a double loop), it is open to interpretation (in part due to preconceived beliefs on what makes up the skill (i.e. edge vs. toe pick) and how skills are developed and achieved). What you are asking coaches (and I suppose judges and parents) to do is to open themselves up to a paradigm shift in skill development. And, much like open-source software where the nuts and bolts are not held proprietarily but made available to everyone to see and thus learn from and further develop, you seem to have no problems with putting it out there and sharing this information. Good for you.
    In a sport such a figure skating that has had such a bad reputation for secrecy and double standards (i.e. judging) I suspect that you are ruffling a few feathers. If this serves to make everyone equally more knowledgeable, then it is a good thing. Thanks.
    P.S. You mentioned in the video that you are not using “Dartfish.” What software are you using if any?

    Reply
  12. Charyl

    Trevor,

    Great! Maybe this will put more coaches on the same track. This can only make the quality of skating better!

    Thanks!
    Charyl

    Reply
  13. Lorna Brown

    THANKS FOR THE SERVICE….THIS IS GREAT AS I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING. I SAW A GREAT VIDEO A LONG TIME AGO WHEN I TAUGHT IN DENMARD BY “IVAN MOWER” HE DID A LOT OF RESEARCH. AS A SCIENTIST AND PHYSICYST. HE SHOWED EVERYTHIN IN GREAT DETAIL AND ALSO FILMED THE JUMPS FROM DIRECTLY ABOVE THE SKATERGREAT VIDEO TO SEE….! I HAVE IT SOMEWHERE ON THE VHS SYSTEM SO WILL TRY TO FIND IT AND MAKE YOU A COPY.
    I LOVE WHAT YOU ARE DOING – IT IS AWSOME! IT IS ABOUT TIME SOMEONE DID THIS AND “YOU ARE”! CONGRATS
    LORNA BROWN

    Reply
  14. Mark Beck

    Trevor:
    Thanks for your continuing info. When I learned to skate, my coach watched, and told me what to change;
    but he wasn’t great, at that stage in his career, about
    delivering a strong overarching technique. Of course, I
    did the stuff, and knew how it felt; and teaching also
    taught me to think about how to try to do things for
    students who moved or felt differently than I did. It
    has been a process, and I am better than when I started.. and also stronger in some things than others.
    I appreciate seeing your videos, and hearing stronger
    technicians than myself explain what they are seeing. I
    really think technique is fascinating. I also would like to hear what judges think, in determining Grade of
    Execution decisions. Thanks, Mark

    Reply
  15. kathy

    Thank you Trevor for all your efforts.
    I joke with my students that the only reason jump technique is so fraught with misconceptions is that they were defined before super-slow-mo was invented. 😉

    Gus Lussi was so far ahead of his time, and I feel fortunate to have received training in his straight-line technique when I did.

    Many coaches and skaters will argue with me over the techniques, but it is hard to argue with success. I hope you get a chance to clear up the definitions surrounding “Butterflies”, Arabians”, “Wagonhoffers”, and “Death drops”.

    Kick Ice!
    :)kat

    Reply
  16. G. Webster Smith

    Hey Trevor,

    I just want to thank you so very much on these videos. It reenforces what we are doing right and also what we may be doing wrong. I feel I am a pretty good technical coach and truly appreciate being able to brush up on some things, that I wasn’t doing before. I am really listening to myself more and using all the experience I have been able to receive from top notch fellow coaches. I always want to be the best coach I can be for all my students and parents. With this site, it gives us the tools to become just that.

    With Vision,

    G. Webster Smith

    Reply
  17. Charles

    Trevor,
    Great video series! One element your not hitting on ( at least not yet) is why do most skaters fall when jumping? In my 12 years of coaching I teach a very simple but crucial technique. From the time a skater hits their take off edge ( whether it’s forward or backwards ) it is imperative that right handed skaters have the left shoulder in front at all times and even continues through the landing position. Left handed skaters use this holding the right side in front. I use this method of jumping from the time they first start waltz jumps through every jump they learn. It keeps skaters from over rotating jumps. In 12 years of coaching and using this technique my skaters have not taken a serious fall or suffered an injury while learning jumps. Most of my kids once they get use to the shoulder being in front it becomes second nature and makes learning new jumps easier and they get jumps quicker. I also teach this same technique you outline here. I had Russian coaches and they all taught these same concepts back in the early 90’s.

    Charles

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  18. kelly

    That’s good…get the truth out… it is important to know that a “double” loop is really a “1 and a half” loop, I’ve been coaching that for a long time.

    I recently asked an off ice jump class “how many of the 6 jumps take off the toepick?, if you don’t jump off the toe, your not using your calf muscle right?” Well, needless to say half said 3 and half said 6 (those must have been my skaters:) Let’s be honest, right? The facts are…

    Thanks for putting it out there!

    Kelly

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  19. Linda Cowper

    Trevor, I don’t know how you found my name and address to mail me your card but I am glad you did. I too understand the jump technique you describe in your loop jump video and have been teaching that way for years.(29 to be exact!) Honestly it is the only thing that makes sense when you look at the design of the blade and how it should operate underneath ones body.I was blessed to take from Mr. Lussi in my teens and he turned me on to these concepts and I am eternally grateful. I also feel these technics are very easy for the student to grasp-Cuts way back on number of reps in the learning process. Kudos!!! Linda

    Reply
  20. Marie

    Trevor,
    This is really good and many caoches can benefit from it. Both Jimmy and I have used Dartfish, thanks to Chris Conte, and for my beginner skaters learning singles including the Axel & doubles, I use video twice a week – using slow motion to explain the corrections or NOT (in some cases)of the jump they see themselves doing. I feel that a visual for skaters is VERY beneficial and what you’re doing is great. And FREE??!!! – amazing! Thank you!

    Reply
  21. Laura

    Trevor,

    I was really excited to find such helpful information about skating jumps on the web! You mentioned in the first video that you had a program similar to the dartfish capable of slow-mo playback but less expensive. Any ideas for someone from a small club with a small budget to obtain such a great resource without having to buy the expensive dartfish program? Thank you again for the help I can’t wait to show my skaters and there parents!

    Reply
  22. Lauri W.

    Thank you so much! I took a 20+ year break between skating competitively and coaching. I am all about learning different ways to communicate what I’m trying to tell them. 20 years is a long time to remember how my coaches explained things to me! Or didn’t explain things to me:)

    Thanks again,

    Lauri W.

    Reply
  23. Gail

    Interesting…I’ve always just thought it was “common sense” to take off from the toe pick and to jump forward then rotate.

    Reply
  24. Gail King

    Thank you so much. What a great idea. If the US is ever going to recaputure a world leadership position in this sport, it needs all coaches getting the basic principles correct. The opportunity cost it takes to correct incorrectly taught techniques to a skater is immeasurable.

    Reply
  25. Mary Alice

    Why not present at the PSA conference? What an opportunity for you to share your informatin to hundreds of coaches.

    Reply
  26. Karolina

    I would like to say thank you for this valuable information. Being a coach from Australia, I am trying to bring the standard of skaters up to the rest of the world. I have a Sport Coaching Degree from University but sometimes it goes in one ear and out the other with the people here. I am bringing in video analysis into the sport here and I feel that is it crucial that all skaters get the correct information and feedback to be able to develop into the best skater they can be. I am always looking into developing my coaching skills to help benefit my skaters. Once again I would like to thank you.

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  27. joy

    I got the survey questions right! Though the backward take off/forward take off question should be clarified. It begins as a backward edge, but results in a forward take off. I tell all my students, back of the blade, middle of the blade front of the blade [meaning the toe] and that takes you until you are facing forward to jump. I tell them the same thing for the salchow. I’m looking forward to the next video! I’ve learned a lot of coaching tips by watching, slow mo and pausing, skating on TV. I really could use the extra tips because I do a lot of my coaching as instinct. No one teaches you how to coach! Though I’ve been to seminars, etc., much of what I do comes from experience and analyzing how it feels to do the move myself. I don’t coach my daughter, but I do notice that her coaches don’t always agree on technique and that’s frustrating. I also find that you have to teach the same technique in a different manner to different skaters. Some need extra tricks to help them see the way.

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  28. Melissa Peterson

    Thanks Trevor! I took lessons from several different coaches and they all taught jumps differently. It seems to be the norm that there is more than one way of doing things. After viewing your videos, I am going try things your way.

    Reply
  29. Linda

    Thanks Trevor! Makes perfect sense if you stop to think about it. I was always taught it was the edge but not breaking it down technically as to what is really happening. I did realize the toe pick was involved but not putting it together.

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  30. Kate

    This information is very helpful as a figure skater and a coach. I will definitely try these techniques with my students.

    Reply
  31. Juner

    Wonderful support for coaches…great for reasurring technique…I soaked in every word, but I want more and more….keep going…I love to learn!

    Reply
  32. michelle

    Thank you for really caring about the future of our sport. I enjoyed the videos very much, keep them coming.

    Reply
  33. K Derickson

    Trevor,

    Great information. I’ve attended one of the Grassroots to Champions seminars and am looking forward to you bringing your seminar to Everett, WA this summer. I’m the director in Everett and can’t wait for my students to participate in the seminar. I’m looking forward to your upcoming video’s.

    K Derickson

    Reply
  34. Maria de Lourdes

    Ok so I answer right that the take off is forward and that is from the toe pick on a loop jump but the part that I’m wrong according to you is that I put that in a loop jump you jump about 1/2 to 3/4 of a jump and you said is 1/4 to a 1/2 so you think if one of my students in preliminary level in a competition performs 1/4 of the jump it would get full credit???? or this would only be on a double, triple, etc….

    Reply
  35. Kerilee

    Great video! I agree with all that you are teaching. I did not take the quiz but, I would have for sure got 2 of the three right, but I don’t know if I would have gone with what I teach and feel or with what the tech. rules state. My question would be to skaters who maybe doing it right but not have the video to prove that they are jumping up facing forward. Does if feel to them like they are taking off forward or backwards. The last thing to leave the ice is the toe and you have proven that they are forward when this happens, but when the skater starts the thrust up off the ball of the foot are they still not backwards? At what point does the skater feel like they have left the ice?

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  36. Melanie

    Thanks for providing information like this on a large scale. What I would like to know is where in Ontario, Canada I can find video analysis software and where to receive training on how to use it. I have been looking for quite some time and have not been able to get much information. You mentioned you do not use Dartfish, what do you recommend?

    Reply
  37. Martie

    Trevor,

    Anytime we get the conversation going, we advance the sport.

    Thank you for your expertise,

    Martie

    Reply
  38. rebecca

    Thank you so much for this great website. Now i know for sure about the loop jump. My first coach always said it is a backwards edg jump. I was at a point of feeling stuck. I moved out of state,and my new coach said the same things that you are confirming about the loop jump. What a difference it made,and the loop jump went from the feeling of always being stuck,to the feeling of flying free. Thank you,Rebecca. Look forward to seeing more on this great website.

    Reply
  39. Laure

    Trevor, thank you soooo much for offering this information to coaches for FREE!!! I am a 21 year-old college student who has been coaching for two years. I was recently discouraged after discovering that icoachskating.com charges $30 a month to access videos and other training tips. With all the expenses skating presents, it is a comfort to know that I can better my education without dropping a load of cash. Thanks so much for the info!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Laure

    Reply
  40. Sharon

    Trevor,

    I found your web site great! Thank you. I teach entry level skating and have been teaching for years, and I always thought the double jumps and also the single jumps were executed this way, and in my own way have taught them this way, but didn’t talk about it to anyone.I can finally come out of the closet!How about Skating Spin Secrets? As I said, I’ve been teaching for years, but I never want to stop learning, Thanks.

    Reply
  41. Ian Youle

    You say the loop takes off forward, but look at the take off edge tracing. It curves around about 90 degrees, before having that little “check mark” on the end. The “check mark” is only about thirty degrees from the initial edge, so to say that the skater is “forward” is a bit of an exaggeration. Thirty degrees past sideways would be more like it! And is the skater actually moving forward? The length of the “check mark” is about a third of a blade length. I think of a loop as follows. The skating foot on the entry edge turns almost 90 degrees, with the skater’s weight about one third of the way back from the toe-pick, as it should be for someone skating backwards. The foot then stops briefly, just as it would stop in a back three turn, except that the skater’s weight doesn’t go back to the heel, but rather rolls forward up to the toe pick, as the skater employs the calf muscles to get a last bit of spring. The time required for this to happen accounts for some slight rotation between the edge itself and the “check mark at the end of the takeoff. The blade itself is not moving forward. It is almost stationary. It is only the point of pressure that moves toward the front of the blade.

    Also, when teaching, it is important to tell a skater how something should feel. It is perhaps even more important than telling them the absolute truth about the mechanics of the jump. (Although, I should add, I do try to give them that truth too). Does anybody actually feel that they skate forward up into the air when they do a loop jump? I never do, and I have never heard a skater say so either.

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  42. meredith white

    Hey Trevor,
    This site is really great, i am a new coach just starting out and am wanting to make sure that the kids im teaching are getting good basic fundenmentals! This site really helps to get the basics that are so important. I used to train in colorado springs with Dartfish only now that i have moved i don’t always have access to that luxery. This is a great way to get that info thanks!

    Reply
  43. david

    Hi Trevor , glad you are so ambitious to do this great teaching aid.
    I think that it will be important to keep in mind that there are different ways of doing take offs. It will be important for you to cover the different methods for each jump , otherwise it will just keep being confusing. For instance you could study Tim Gable’s quad salchow , and most of all understand how his method works. Then study the french skater ( sorry his name eludes me ) that swings his left arm ( front arm )back and takes off more like an axle , like Scott Hamilton did in his later pro days. It may be a great idea to talk to Scott and ask him why he changed his technique on his salchow.
    On the flip and lutz you’ll see how some swing the front arm down and through to the back and up ( Don Jackson called this the statue of liberty arm )
    John Pekavich has a good book out , he mentions the walking action of the arms as others have a small arm action where the hands meet infront
    On the double loop I swung my front arm to the back before lift off , like Tanya Harding.
    On the Axel the edge hooks or sometimes skids some as the foot turns on takeoff , but the body has to be kept from rotating. It’s easy to look at it and say thay turn on the ice before going up but that just messes up the axel , it’s only the foot that should turn , unless you do a Tara Lipinski takeoff where the free side starts more behind and swings through for rotation , but it’s really just a spin off the ice and not a good jump , no way she could do a delayed axel like Dorthy Hamill had so nice
    Like I said earlier , to analyze jumps one must look at all the differnt methods for each jump and understand how each one works , and differentiate them
    Look at John Curry’s triple or double loop , then look at Maria Buterskia’s triple loop and you’ll see the John had alot of upper body rotation before lift off and Maria stayed checked , John’s upper body ends up ahead of the takeoff blade and Maria’s the opposite
    I think it’s great theat yoou’r doing this , but to keep the confusion out you will have to be clear about the different methods and how they work . Email me if you want to discuss it
    Cheers , Dave

    Reply
  44. david

    Regarding turning half a turn before lift off. I know coaches that stress alot on this and they teach toe axels on the toe loop , ending up with a badly executed jump. I think that it is important to be carefull how much the turn is stressed. I like the up and open takeoff where you can do delayed doubles , then for the triple you just pull in quicker as leaving the ice , Dave

    Reply
  45. Trevor

    David,

    Thanks for the comment.

    You are correct in stating that there are many ways to do the jumps and a complete discussion and analysis of each jump would really help eliminate the confusion. I have plans to do that early next year. I’ve been so busy with iCOACHSKATING.com that I haven’t had time to add more clarifications to Skating Jump Secrets.

    Even though there’s many ways to do the jumps, I contend there’s really just one way or small number of ways that are the best for the vast majority of skaters. Determining the best way and helping all coaches understand why it’s the best way would really go a long way toward improving skater technique at the developmental level.

    Obviously, we’re all different, so individual skaters may need technique modifications based on their physical structure, natural movement patterns, and previously learned technique. But that doesn’t change the fact that there is probably one way that is most efficient (least effort required), consistent (simple and repeatable), and natural (easy to learn) for most skaters.

    The initial videos at Skating Jump Secrets were my attempt to show coaches (and skaters and parents too since they said they were interested) that a loop jump lifts off forward (just one of many important and misunderstood concepts). If you watched the videos you saw my initial survey results. My latest survey results are better but still show a huge percentage of coaches don’t fully understand the loop jump mechanics.

    I haven’t spent any time yet at Skating Jump Secrets talking about how to get a skater to pivot to forward. Instead I just made an observation. But that’s really where many coaches lack knowledge about skating.

    They simply don’t know what actually happens in a jump. If they knew the precise mechanics of the jumps, they would develop teaching methods and “techniques” to develop those proper mechanics in their skaters.

    When I teach a seminar for coaches, in the off-ice portion I simply show coaches 30 or 40 jumps frame-by-frame and make a number of critical observations for each jump. Many coaches sit in bewilderment, astonished at what they’re seeing with their own eyes. Because they observe it, they never argue about it, and the discussion soon turns to “why” instead of “what”. They don’t even ask “how” because they know they can figure that out.

    After they know what to look for, the vast majority of coaches can develop teaching methods to help them make sure the proper mechanics happen. They usually don’t need hand-holding once they know what to look for.

    As to your comment about the forward take-off concept causing toe axels, I have a very different experience. I’ve observed that most coaches who have skaters with toe axels don’t understand the actual mechanics of the toe loop jump. They don’t understand that the jump takes off forward, or that the skate continues skating backward past the toe pick, or even how the weight is transferred and rotation is generated. If they understood exactly what a toe axel is and what a double toe loop is, they could and would fix it. I make that claim based on working with many coaches.

    I appreciate your input Dave and love it when coaches truly think about jump technique/mechanics at a deep level. You’ve obviously thought about it a lot and made some great observations. Thanks and good luck with your own coaching!

    Trevor

    Reply
  46. kim Johnson

    Thank you so much. This was so informative. I look forward to seeing more video’s and learning more. Just terrific!

    Thanks, Kim

    Reply
  47. olga

    great information,thank you very much,I already teach the jump in this way and all my students practice in this way.
    thank you very much,olga

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  48. dobrila

    Hi, this is great. Especially I found useful explanation about 2Axel. Also I think that is for coaches very important to know different in technique between double and triple jumps. The best wishes. Dobrila

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  49. kathy harris

    Hi, I just have one observation not mentioned…. I took the loop jump quiz and got the questions all correct..not because I am especially knowledgable, but I learned to skate as an adult who questions everything. I competed and tested and currently am an adult silver skater. But in teaching Learn to Skate for our figure skating club, I found that kids will not question and if told to jump from the red line to the blue one, they probably will attempt to do that.In doing a loop jump myself, I found yes indeed I am taking off frontward rather than backward, and need to reach and literally rock up from and to my toepick. (one of my coaches said they are not there for decoration, and she was so right) Also in teaching that (loop) and a salchow if I pointed out to them that even though it is called a whole rotation jump it is really 1/2 that helped them get both right away, especially if I said that there is a curve before the jump not a straight line with a full turn.

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  50. Tim Grafton

    Trevor, I loved the video and it had me thinking about the jump technique for a loop jump, I put your links on my web site timcoach.com.au and I think all figure skating coaches should view your videos. My thought is that the survey results would have been worse, but you sent it to the people who registered for your web site, those are the people who want to learn, the coaches that could not be bothered improving their coaching knowledge would not be going to your web site and they would have fared worse on the survey. I think the reason for the large number of incorrect answers is that many coaches are not good technicians, they are good in other ways such as people skills and/or marketing themselves.

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  51. sharon upton

    you are driving me crazy your videos keep freezing and the only information i am getting is the same introductory you give in all of your videos. can you stop repeating the introductory stuff so i can get into the meat of your content or tell me how to stop the videos freezing i have two young children and the time i have available is precious i havw spent hours now hearing the same stuff i am happy to subscribe if i can short cut all the introductory stuff and the soft sell can we just get to the point please

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  52. Nancy

    Hi, do you give privatte lessons? I am from Mexico. It would e great if we could get you to come and work with my students. Please let me know.

    Thank you so much for this website.

    Nancy

    Reply
  53. Mary-Ellen

    This a great way to pass on technics to coaches who are working with skaters who are not seeing top skaters on a regular basis. The technics you are passing on to everyone goes back when I was training with Jacques Gerschweiler in the 60s, it is great to see that someone like yourself is carrying on these technics.
    thank you for caring.

    Mary-Ellen coach from Western Australia.

    Reply
  54. Margaret

    Thank you so much for your website!! It’s about time that someone came up with something so helpful! It is also refreshing to know that most of the things that I have been teaching to my students are correct…according to you and your website! The loop jump take off has been an argument in the area that I teach in for years and it makes me feel so much better to know that there are more people out there who agree that it DOES take off forward and from the toe!! Your Jump Manual is going to be a great tool to have at the rink, not only for Myself, but for my skaters….and hopefully other Coaches! I look forward to more information and video’s that you may post in the future!!

    Thanks Again,
    Margaret

    Reply
  55. Daphne Solis

    Thank you for creating this site. I actually did know the answers to the three questions in video two and seeing my skater’s faces when I tell them that a double salchow is really just an axel never gets old! It is a big confidence booster because typically they can already do their axel.

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  56. Gary Beacom

    What happens during a good jump, Trevor, and what a skater thinks or feels during a good jump are not the same. You have not shown how your video analysis of what actually happens is of benefit to skaters to achieve ideal jumps. More specifically, I note that the most satisfying and elegant jump arises from eliminating all turning sensation on take offs. It is all stored in the leaning edges and will manifest itself automatically simply by jumping.

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  57. graeme

    Trevor, I agree totally with your written comments about the double toe and what causes the ‘toe axel’. A clean double toe DOES take off from forward. Anyone can see this by watching a good 2T or 3T in slow-mo. A toe axel is caused by the right foot not gliding past the toe pick. If the right foot glide stops early, you have the classic (and dreaded) toe axel.

    Reply
  58. Helga Kristín Olsen

    I just want to thank you so very much on these videos and your tips. I´m coaching in Iceland so your message has truly travelled far 🙂 As many coaches I think it is very important to reenforces what we are doing right but also what we can do better so we truly can be better. I will bring your Jump Manual to my rink to share with others, coaches and skaters. Thank you again for all your work and I look forward to see more video´s and good information and tips.

    Thank you,
    Helga

    Reply
  59. Tina MacConnell

    This truly is a fantastic web-site. Since joining and watching your videos I have used several of your “secret” techniques in my coaching, and I can already see a great improvement in my skaters’ jumps. Thank you for sharing 🙂

    Reply
  60. Tammy Van Scheyndel

    Hi Trevor

    Great information and insight into the different coaching tecniques. I had been linked to your website before and then all of a sudden the information stopped coming some time ago. Of course I’ve had computer issues as well so that might be why. I am a coach in Canada and I recently had a skater get a report card from a competition she was at. They are now using the CPC at all starskate and higher competitions. She had the majority of her double downgraded to singles and having watch still photos of her it looks as though the reasoning my be for turning to far before the take-off (like taking off forward for the double loop)now in all fairness I would say from what I saw briefly it was that her upper body was well ahead of the lower body and had they all moved together this may have made a difference in how it was received by the techs and judges.

    Thanks again looking forward to having the information back for my review to help prepare my skaters better for next season.

    Tammy

    Reply
  61. Anonymous

    Trevor, I am so happy to see you are still helping all of us. In the past you have been so helpful. I am looking forward to receiving all the help you can give me to make it easier for my skaters to learn. Thank you,Loismarierespect

    Reply
  62. Ron Kaiser

    Hi Trevor,

    I’m surprised by your survey results. I’ve watched videos of all the jumps for many years and so, like yourself, became aware of how much rotation is actually done in the air and the role of the toe pik in all jumps. However, as you state in your video this is not new knowledge. My coach used to say way back in the 70’s that all jumps are toe jumps.

    Having this knowledge is of definite benefit to both you and your skaters as it gives you an overall understanding of what is actually occurring in the jump and at the moment of takeoff especially.

    However, having this knowledge is great but needs to be tempered somewhat in that it should be seen as another tool in your knowledge toolbox. I have to agree with a couple of your commentators above letters. Ian Youle writes that how a jump “feels” is of more importance. What is actually happening on the ice and what a skater feels and needs to think of doing are two entirely different things. For example, if you try to get skaters to think about facing forward on a loop jump before they jump you are going to probably have some “timing” issues.

    I also agree with my fellow countryman Gary Beacom when he writes that there should be “no turning sensation on takeoffs”. As he and another famous Canadian, Don Jackson, more or less both say: “let the edges do the work”. In a nutshell, I think one needs to be cautious when attempting to get skaters to do exactly what is shown on video. It needs to be balanced with what the jump is supposed to “feel” like.

    Thanks Trevor for opening this website. It is great to debate jump technique and I also really enjoy reading what other coaches think. Sharing of knowledge and ideas is always great as it is of benefit to all of us!

    Ron

    Reply
  63. Jessica Barron

    Trevor thousand thanks for the excellent work you do is a good source of information for all coaches. I learned a lot from the analysis you do in referral is to take off the jumps.

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  64. pippa

    We think you are a very generous person to have gone to such trouble to help coaches. Our aim is to bring happiness to ordinary skaters and we feel this will give us the confidence to help them as much as we can .. thankyou

    Reply
  65. Debbie Allen

    I knew these answers because of your iCoachingSkating.com & have adopted most if not all the suggestions in them. It’s great how every generation expands their knowledge for our sport. That is why we have skaters doing triples & quads. When I was a young skater a double Axel was amazing.
    Thank you Trever for all your hard work towards educating coaches.

    Reply
  66. Lisa

    yes looking at the ice there is a flag on a double sal or loop…but it seems that it happens as a law of physics rather then a taught skill. to teach you back up into the take off rather then turn forward still has the same result when you play it in slow motion..i have videoed….so if you teach turn forward and take off..the skater seems to think turn upper body….if you teach it feels like you are jumping back up into the air…they seem to have a better take off. I have taught awesome high single loops that transfer to doubles etc.. when saying you have to feel like you are jumping back up into the air….equally the idea of the back spin up into the air. So what you feel and what the ice says is happening appears feel different. on the loop..you press off the edge….but the last part of the blade to leave the ice is the toe….if you say press of the toe to a skater who is learning loop or double..they scratch on the toe pick all the way up to the lift off creating a drag on the toe pick up into the air cause lack of height. So the focus is still on the edge starting the rotation and when to lift , timing with knee action.

    Reply
  67. Lisa

    The edge starts the rotation..then you press down against it and push up ward with knee timing…you are already much away from the ice before the toe actually is the last to leave the ice.

    Reply
  68. Veronique van der Hammen

    wow your website is great, I am from South Africa and we are not that many coaches , we obviously pick up techniques from our own coaches when we skated , watching the loop jump and your explaining the technique – is so logical

    Thank you

    Reply
  69. Jodie

    Thank you for putting all this information together and explaining it in an easy format to follow! Being a newer coach this resource is wonderful! I’m always searching for information and it seems so hard to find those coaches that will share, so THANK YOU! Jodie

    Reply
  70. Tracey

    I LOVE YOUR BRAIN!!! Holy smokes, man – you are pioneering a strength in our sport that no one has ever seen! Thank you for empowering us on the ice, and thus empowering our skaters! I love this video – can’t wait to see the rest! Being on Icoach.com, and consistently implementing the skills, technique and theory to elements discussed made me a believer, and this site/video is just further proof. I’m so excited to be a part of this wave of knowledge and change! Thanks Trevor!

    Reply
  71. Monica Jackson Wittenburg

    Hi Trevor!!
    Thank you for bringing this info to the forefront of skating. I am a new coach(2yrs) and a long time figure skater(still going strong). Over the years I’ve been skating, jumps were hard for me being they were inconsistent. Of course I have taught the only way that I was taught, but now my students and myself will be trained in your New Way!! I come from a rink that has very little technology, but I knew there just had to be a better way and I’m thankful for finding your site and having your instruction. It makes perfect sense!! Please keep up your hard work and dedication to this sport and I look forward to learning more from you!!

    Sincerely,
    Monica Jackson Wittenburg

    Reply

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